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What can we learn from Russian forums?

If you are putting something to distill, drink or eat that you don't know where to put it, then put it here. Let us help you decide.

Re: What can we learn from Russian forums?

Postby S-Cackalacky » Tue Jan 09, 2018 9:14 am

I have an app on my smart phone that allows me to take a picture of printed text and it then converts it to regular digital text that can then be edited, or whatever. Don't know if it would work with crylic, but might be worth looking into.
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Re: What can we learn from Russian forums?

Postby Y1969 » Tue Jan 09, 2018 11:35 am

S-Cackalacky wrote:I have an app on my smart phone that allows me to take a picture of printed text and it then converts it to regular digital text that can then be edited, or whatever. Don't know if it would work with crylic, but might be worth looking into.

Unfortunately, these books are not scanned by me, the quality is disgusting. I tried to automatically recognize this text, nothing good happened. Every second word with errors. Now I will make a typical page, you can try.
Keep in mind that the books are written in my native language and I can correct it in the MS Word. A foreigner who does not speak Russian will definitely get one continuous problem.
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Re: What can we learn from Russian forums?

Postby Y1969 » Tue Jan 09, 2018 11:49 am

Here is the section on cleaning vodka.
By the way. This book should be in the Library of Congress or in the MIT library
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Re: What can we learn from Russian forums?

Postby Kareltje » Tue Jan 09, 2018 5:49 pm

That are the instructions you already posted, are they not?
I had them translated in Dutch, but of course a translation in English is better for this forum:

he technology of processing with dry milk (for vodka type "Posolskaya") consists of the following operations.

1. In a mixer, prepare a water-alcohol mixture (sorting) in such a way as to obtain vodka with a strength of 40%
2. The obtained aqueous alcohol mixture is pumped into a special container, where dry skimmed milk is prescribed in the amount of 3.1-6.2 kg per 1000 dal of vodka (depending on the hardness and salt composition of water used in the plant).
The required amount of dried milk is established by the laboratory of the plant on the basis of a trial experimental blend, according to which the coagulation rate and the character of the sludge flakes are determined.
3. Skimmed milk powder is pre-poured with 10 liters of warm water (temperature 40-45 ° C), mixed and left to swell for 2-3 hours, after which it is asked for sorting.
4. After the addition of milk, the resulting mixture is thoroughly mixed with air or mechanically and left to stand for 1-3 hours. Under the influence of alcohol, coagulation of the milk protein occurs, which ends in the settling process by precipitation of the colloidal substance into the precipitate.
Flocculent protein flakes possessing a highly developed surface are able to sorb the soluble organic substances contained in the aqueous alcoholic mixture, especially those with a large molecular weight, which usually have unpleasant organoleptic properties, as well as hardly soluble compounds that cause the formation of a turbidity, for example, hardness salts (Ca and Mg). Due to this, the treatment of water-alcohol mixtures with milk has a discoloring and clarifying effect (gives the product a crystal shine), neutralizes the aroma and softens the taste.
5. At the end of settling, the water-alcohol mixture is filtered on the Progress filter.
6. From the filter press, the water-alcohol mixture is sent to the pressure tank, from where (after checking the strength) gravity is fed to the coal-cleaning column at a filtration rate of up to 40 dal / h on fresh coal and up to 30 dal / h on coal undergoing regeneration .
7. The residue of the coagulated protein remaining on the bottom of the vat is sent to a residue to extract alcohol.


In the thread starting with this text different variations of this process are discussed. Like not using powder of skimmed milk but skimmed milk as such, whole milk, white of egg in stead of milk, distilling after milk treatment in stead of carbon filtering etc. Even distilling before all the milk was filtered out (not advisable, as the protein is burned!). Adding bentonite to help precipitation. All with arguments pro and contra.
I found that precipitation was not complete without adding lemon juice.
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Re: What can we learn from Russian forums?

Postby Y1969 » Wed Jan 10, 2018 2:05 am

it must be understood that the recipe given was compiled in the 1960s. The quality of alcohol in those days was not very high. The isoelectric point of the protein is in the zone of a weakly acid medium. Coagulation requires a hydrogen index of slightly less than 7. Your moonshine appears to contain few organic acids, it is of good quality, so coagulation without acid addition does not occur.
The question arises. If your moonshine is good, can it just add a little lactose and do not practice technology from the time of Queen Victoria?
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Re: What can we learn from Russian forums?

Postby Kareltje » Wed Jan 10, 2018 6:42 am

Well, distilling itself is even older than 1960 :D

One batch of my moonshine is not good: it has a soapy taste. I tried several ways of redistilling, but it sticks to almost all samples of all runs. Tried washing soda and as that did not work I tried milk. At first I thought the fat could take up the higher alcohols, so I started with cream. Later the possibility of protein came up and I tried skimmed milk.
Now I am waiting for carbon to arrive and if that does not work I have to use it as a fuel.

Then go searching for the cause, so I can prevent it next year! :evil:
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Re: What can we learn from Russian forums?

Postby Y1969 » Wed Jan 10, 2018 12:13 pm

Kareltje wrote: ...One batch of my moonshine is not good: it has a soapy taste...


I will propose another scheme. It makes sense not to try to improve moonshine. I suggest you, sir, immediately rectify the good. Make a column of 50 mm diameter, 2000-2200 mm high, fill the column with a spiral-prismatic package of 2 mm. This will allow getting alcohol quality, better than GOST 5962-2013. In EU, there is GOST (euronorm) for alcohol? That's what these standards need to follow. Why did they write these standards?

http://docs.cntd.ru/document/1200103298

Set yourself the task of rectifying alcohol with a class higher than "alpha."
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Re: What can we learn from Russian forums?

Postby Kareltje » Wed Jan 10, 2018 7:02 pm

Dear colleague, I surely appreciate your advice. Problem is: I do not have a large rectifying column and have no resources to build one in the near future.
So I have to use my spiral column or thumper to try to separate the alcohol from the bad stuff. This bad taste seems to spread through the whole run, from heads to tails and especially in the heart. It kind of makes me desperate.

Ah, now I know what they mean by GOST in the Russian forums. I don't know if the EU has rules that are comparable. There are rules about handling ethanol, as there are rules about every chemical substance, of course.
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Re: What can we learn from Russian forums?

Postby Y1969 » Thu Jan 11, 2018 8:26 am

Colleague, if you do not yet have the opportunity to use a large column, I propose a third scenario: I advise you not to distill at all, but to use the mash directly. Pretty tasty and very useful. In yeast, a lot of vitamin B, all sorts of probiotics and other yummy. I have an acquaintance who wanted to start making moonshine. Several times fermented mash and never before it did not reach the rectification.
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Re: What can we learn from Russian forums?

Postby Kareltje » Thu Jan 11, 2018 6:39 pm

Hi mate!
Your friend must have been very thirsty! :D

I quenched my thirst in other ways. :mg: So now I have a considerable amount of bad tasting distillate.
It is an ongoing search for cleaning the result of three destillations of sugar wash of 2017.
Well, it is useless now. So I feel free to experiment at my hearts desire: it is lost anyway, better put it to some use.

I am slowly translating the Russian thread, I am in no hurry. Set up some experiments for myself.
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Re: What can we learn from Russian forums?

Postby Y1969 » Fri Jan 12, 2018 1:08 am

There is a fourth scenario. You buy a ticket to Copenhagen-Moscow, take with you a bad moonshine, we distil it in Moscow as it should. Only need to go by train (via Geneva or Berlin). You can not transport moonshine in a airplane.
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Re: What can we learn from Russian forums?

Postby Kareltje » Sat Jan 13, 2018 5:21 pm

Y1969 wrote:There is a fourth scenario. You buy a ticket to Copenhagen-Moscow, take with you a bad moonshine, we distil it in Moscow as it should. Only need to go by train (via Geneva or Berlin). You can not transport moonshine in a airplane.

Mate!
As much as I like Denmark, I think there must be a train from a Dutch city.
The idea is appealing, be it just for fun! :8)
But I flatter myself by thinking I know a bit how to distill. :roflmao:

Typical that you go on finding new solutions! That is what I like!
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Re: What can we learn from Russian forums?

Postby minime » Sun Jan 14, 2018 11:14 pm

Y1969 wrote:take with you a bad moonshine, we distil it in Moscow as it should


Russians aren't better distillers, but definitely fussy'ier drinkers :lol:
Never save the best for last!
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Re: What can we learn from Russian forums?

Postby Y1969 » Tue Jan 16, 2018 11:52 am

I agree!
The best specialists in distillation are, undoubtedly, Germans. Even before the Second World War in Göttingen, the basic principles of the rectification column were formulated. But we do not have any acquaintances of the Germans, we will have to be transported to Russia.
---
About Denmark and Holland. I'm completely confused. In the movie "Bron/Broen" where does it happen?
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Re: What can we learn from Russian forums?

Postby Kareltje » Tue Jan 16, 2018 12:57 pm

Holland is only a small part of the Netherlands! In Russian: Голландия is not the same as Нидерланды.
It is said some presidents of the USoA think that Copenhagen is the same as The Hague, but the first is the capital of Denmark and the second the seat of the government of the Netherlands. Our capital is Amsterdam. The first is in the province South Holland, the second in the province North Holland. The confusion Holland = Netherlands is often made, shamefull enough also by Dutch people!
I always feel a bit offended when people suggest I am from Holland. :mg: :roflmao:

I looked it up: Bron/Broen is Swedish/Danish for Bridge. That is a series about the bridge between Denmark and Sweden. The Danish side of this bridge lands a bit south of Copenhagen.
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